Curse

Viti Ligo · Jun 27, 2012, 06:06 AM // 06:06

Hi all,

I have run into a e-management problem with my AoD dervs. Before the update I used a pure healer variant with staff as a weapon. Possible e-management problems was easy to solve with BiP hero on team. After update I equip them with scythe dropped wind prayers for earth prayers and gave them scythes. As a result a get much more firepower ( mostly from sand shards ) but also e-management issues - dervs ran out of energy pretty fast as BiP was no more used on them.

The build I tried was:

Zealous Renewal
Sand Shards
Fleeting Stability
Avatar Of Dwayna
Dust cloak or Staggering force
Irresistible Sweep
Eremites Attack
Signet of Pious Light

Now it is possible to fit Zealous Sweep or Radiant scythe in, but it means loss of at least one tear down or enchantment which will lower the healing and even damage output.

Second alternative is using motivation paragon hero. I have bip on General Morgahn so speccing him to motivation could be a solution but problem is that
Zealous Anthem and Aria of Zeal have 20 sec recharge which feels like bit too long....also removing BiP from him could cause e-management problems to my casters and dropping command for motivation means loss of GFTE, fall back and stand your ground which are all pretty usefull....

And yes I really like to have those 2 dervs in my team ( and also I like the AoD on them ).

hirush · Jun 27, 2012, 10:24 AM // 10:24

Try replace Signet of Pious Light with radiant scythe or eremite's zeal. You should be able to afford to lose signet of pious light with AoD's presence.

Sammich · Jun 27, 2012, 07:42 PM // 19:42

I'm assuming you've got a good number of points in mysticism on them? That's about all I can think of, to be honest. If you don't, then put points in mysticism. It'll solve your problem. If you already do have points in mysticism, then I cannot help you, sorry

-Sammich

Drk Dervish · Jun 27, 2012, 11:51 PM // 23:51

You got way to much fast regenerate flash enchantment. Of course your energy can't keep up with those. First you need to push Mysticism to at least 12 that will cut half of your cost for all your 10e flash ench. I would replace Dust for Aura of Thorns for dual condition coverage and combo that with "Reap Impuirites, follow by Eremite follow by Reap again." that three combo should safe you some energy and buy some time for energy. If your still want to keep all those quick flash try using AoL should solve your issue.

Wait just read your using two derv in your team as "hero".

take off what i say above as your trying to run a derv healer hero. FYI is not worth it (personal opinion not trying to start or even worth debate on that topic). I would take off all enchantments except sand shards, and Zealous or replace one Dust or Force for Whirling charge. Come on let face it you just want those ench to end to trigger AoD. Ai rarely cast those flash in the right time to take off advantage of them. I'll take out Eremite's attack and replace with attack skills that don't remove ench (Ai will remove your sand shard. Even in your current build with all that ench coverage, at one point of another it will remove it) as Ai don't care about enchantment or which one to keep. And replace the rest with couple adr attack and one more normal attack.

Hate to say this coming from a Dervish lover myself. Just love prof to death but when it come to Ai Dervish their dead weight, especially if you try to ask them to run multiple or complex enchantments bar.

Viti Ligo · Jun 28, 2012, 06:19 AM // 06:19

Thanks for replies.

Forgot to mention attributes in my original post but I run them with:

mysticism 11+1+2
earth prayers 10+1
scythe mastery 10+2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sammich

I'm assuming you've got a good number of points in mysticism on them? That's about all I can think of, to be honest. If you don't, then put points in mysticism. It'll solve your problem. If you already do have points in mysticism, then I cannot help you, sorry

-Sammich

As you see, I have already nearly maxed mysticism, rising it more would not not affect to energy management with 5 and 10e spells I have on them. Though lowering their health more might not be as bad as I thought... having quite much protting ( must invest protting with AoD healers ) lowering their health would mean bit more armor, even better damage output and bit less damage from attacks and spells but make them also more vulnerable to conditions. So more cond removal would be needed... gotta try it out, however.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drk Dervish

You got way to much fast regenerate flash enchantment. Of course your energy can't keep up with those. First you need to push Mysticism to at least 12 that will cut half of your cost for all your 10e flash ench. I would replace Dust for Aura of Thorns for dual condition coverage and combo that with "Reap Impuirites, follow by Eremite follow by Reap again." that three combo should safe you some energy and buy some time for energy. If your still want to keep all those quick flash try using AoL should solve your issue.

Wait just read your using two derv in your team as "hero".

take off what i say above as your trying to run a derv healer hero. FYI is not worth it (personal opinion not trying to start or even worth debate on that topic). I would take off all enchantments except sand shards, and Zealous or replace one Dust or Force for Whirling charge. Come on let face it you just want those ench to end to trigger AoD. Ai rarely cast those flash in the right time to take off advantage of them. I'll take out Eremite's attack and replace with attack skills that don't remove ench (Ai will remove your sand shard. Even in your current build with all that ench coverage, at one point of another it will remove it) as Ai don't care about enchantment or which one to keep. And replace the rest with couple adr attack and one more normal attack.

Hate to say this coming from a Dervish lover myself. Just love prof to death but when it come to Ai Dervish their dead weight, especially if you try to ask them to run multiple or complex enchantments bar.

Imo, the dervs are not so bad as heroes. Sure, the melee AI is still quite bad but I can live with it. The reason why I love those dervs is AoD + Signet of Pious Light + few fast recharging derv encantment. So I really don't care too much about what effects their enchantments have, most important thing is that they'll cast them and tear them off as fast as possible. Sure Sand shards has VERY nice effect and don't need to be teared off but with 10 sec recharge it is not enough for AoD to gave steady flow of healing. Even on 2 AoD dervs. Heroes cast AoD when fight starts and start spamming flash enchantments after that, so they most likely will have something to tear down when it is time to use Signet of Pious Light, which heals target for ( in my case with current setup ) 118 + 47 and every ally in earshot ( including MINIONS ) for 47 and if they had enchantment to tear down it recharges in 5 secs .... It's pretty well, imo, considering that they'll deal out respectable damage while doing that. Also they are nearly impossible to interrupt and to to some extend also immune to hexes. Oh, I am derailing here....

Your advice of Aura of Thorns is really a good one. I'll do that. I'll also considering tear downs... fleeting stability + sand shards don't need to be removed but I am not sure they are enough for AoD to produce steady flow of healing, thoug.

I still need to improve their e-management. They usually have enough energy for short fights but need time to recover between fights and have problems on occasional multiple aggros.

It's really bad that BiP heroes ignores melee if they don't wear caster weapons...

Maybe I'll try to fit motivation para in my team but it's seems hard to do without loosing either damage output or essential protting.

Drk Dervish · Jun 28, 2012, 12:52 PM // 12:52

FYI BiP doesn't totally ignores melee, Ai do mainly cast on non melee toon first. Depend how your team is setup. I run Bip in my team and there are times when i get some Bip blessing (maybe bug or not but it happens). This usually happen in the begin of the fight when all my other hero is not hurting for energy.

If BiP is spending lot of time casting on caster then the chance of casting on your derv is slim. Ai will only cast on toon when their energy is below 50%. With derv energy around 25-30 just one or two scythe hit will get above the 50% mark. This is probably why you don't see they cast on them, especially if Bip is spending lot of time casting or caster.

Remember went Ai play Bip would not put their life at risk when their heal drop below ~25% they would not going to cast it again. He will either wait for healing or wait until their hp get regen. A good way to improve Bip cast rate is really let him be battery as in Bip and the with rit healing skill (or some type of self healing) so he can self heal and recast Bip more often.

p.s if you still bring enchantment removal skill on your dervish is like a double negative discussing how to get Bip work right on your 2 melee derv. Going all that trouble getting Bip on "2" melee (if its even possible) and then give him skill that have a chance to strip it off is will (not to be to rude) it's pointless.

Anyways back to the topic maybe you can try the follwing.

Adding "Meditation" in the bar since your not going to use the adrenaline anyways. This with Zealous scythe with Zealous renewal might have enough energy to pump those ench.

If you open to mes as sec prof and can afford some pts to Inspiration you can try Channel, hero will usually cast that first so the rask of removal is less

Try GoLE but I don't think how much it'll help since your taking flashy with a fast recharge but worth a try.

Viti Ligo · Jun 29, 2012, 05:23 AM // 05:23

I found a solution for this and it was quite easy indeed: dropped Irresistible Sweep for radiant scythe ! I found out that both fleeting stability and sand shards last such a short time that they really do not need a removal skill.

As a result of this they usually seems to have near full energy bars even after long fights, also their healing worked as well, though bit different manner than before. It's not such a steady flow of blue numbers but happens more when needed because more tear downs from signet of pious light.

I tested this at Dasha Vestibule vq and it worked out pretty well and it is area where my other setups have had much more trouble with healing.